Cinecast Episode 238 – Just the Tip, Please.

We’ve got entirely too much content to squeeze into one single episode, and this one is busting at the seams. We kick things off with the Batman 3 Prologue before moving into our Top 5 guy performances. Ghost Protocol sees the Mission Impossible franchise (along with The Dark Knight Rises) usher IMAX 2D back into the conversation. Classically staged action set-pieces abound, and Kurt, Andrew and Gamble dig Brad Bird’s style, even if there is a lament for the Bad Robot momentum over brains approach to the actual plot and characters. More contentious is the David Fincher The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo, which also tastes great, and is also less filling. The boys parse exactly what is Lisbeth Salander, a self-sustaining superhero, or a broken lesbian looking for a conservative/traditional relationship and ponder if handsome and meticulous is enough to praise what is ultimately a middle-of-the-road Fincher joint. As there is a 20 car traffic-jam of new releases over the lead-up to Christmas, we spend some time with other titles floating in the multiplexes: Margin Call, The Sitter, Sherlock Holmes 2 and Tarsem’s Immortals (and Gamble goes gaga over the latter two titles.) The Watchlist, tangents on RedBox, and more homoerotic tension than you can shake a stick at, round out the show in what is, even by our standards, one of epic proportions.

As always, please join the conversation by leaving your own thoughts in the comment section below and again, thanks for listening!


 
 

 


To download the show directly, paste the following URL into your favorite downloader:
http://rowthree.com/audio/cinecast_11/episode_238.mp3

 
 
Full show notes are under the seats…



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IN-HOUSE BUSINESS:
Jandy’s engaged. Congrats!
– Kurt on The Matinee Cast (episode 48)
– Kurt on The Director’s Club (Hal Hartley)
– New High and Low Brow (season 3 episode 4)
– Matt’s Human Centipede 2 review


TOP 5 MALE PERFORMANCES (2011):

Kurt
5) Bill Nighy Page Eight
4) Michael Parks Red State
3) Brad Pitt Moneyball
2) Jean Dujardin The Artist
1) (listen)

HM: Everyone (Margin Call), John Boyega (Attack the Block), Michael Shannon (Take Shelter), Ralph Zavadill (Beauty Day)

Matt
5) Neil Patrick Harris A Very Harold and Kumar Christmas
4) Lawrence R. Harvey Human Centipede 2
3) Michael Fassbender X-Men: First Class
2) Albert Brooks Drive
1) (listen)

HM: Ben Foster (The Mechanic), Alex Shaffer (Win Win), Buck Branneman (Buck), Michael Perry (Into the Abyss),

Andrew
6) Andy Serkis Rise of the Planet of the Apes
5) Joseph Gordon-Levitt 50/50
4) Michael Parks Red State
3) Adrien Brody Midnight in Paris
2) Albert Brooks Drive
1) (listen)

HM: Brendan Gleeson (The Guard), Michael Fassbender (Shame), Brad Pitt (Moneyball), George Clooney (The Descendants), Leo DiCaprio (J. Edgar), John Hawkes (MMMM), Antonio Banderas (The Skin I Live In)


MAIN REVIEWS:
Mission: Impossible – Ghost Protocol
The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo (Fincher)


OTHER THEATRICAL REVIEWS:
Margin Call
The Sitter
Shame
Young Adult
Sherlock Holmes: A Game of Shadows
Immortals


THE WATCH LIST:

Matt
Paul
Die Hard

Andrew
Crazy, Stupid Love
Apocalypto
The Skin I Live In

Kurt
A Year Without Santa Claus
Muppets Take Manhattan


DVDs/NETLIX NOW AVAILABLE:
Jandy’s DVD Triage


OTHER STUFF MENTIONED:


NEXT WEEK:
The Artist
Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy


PRIVATE COMMENTS or QUESTIONS?
Leave your thoughts in the comment section below, or email us:
feedback@rowthree.com (general)
andrew.james@rowthree.com
kurt@rowthree.com

 
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Matt: Twitter
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Sort by:   newest | oldest | most voted
antho42
Guest

Next week you should do the 5 worst films/disappointing films of the years.

Marina
Guest

Fuckin’ eh for the Gosling love.

Hector
Guest

I completely agree with Gamble about Sherlock Holmes. I absolutely loved it, I wish more popcorn movies where like it.

Gord
Guest

Speaking of Stephen Fry, If you haven’t already you guys should check out Stephen Fry In America. Its a 6 part BBC documentary series that follows Stephen travel through the US. I really enjoyed it. It’s available on Netflix Instant.

Marina
Guest

I haven’t seen his trip to America show but I’ll have to check it out. Last year I caught his doc/special “Wagner and Me” which was fascinating.

Ben Foster is always awesome. He has a tiny role in Rampart but he steals the scenes with Harrelson (who is brilliant).

As for MI4’s sandstorm scene – I wouldn’t be surprised if a big chunk of it is CG but at least parts of it are practical. They turned Mission (the city) into the desert for a few days to shoot that. There was something about it on the local news when they were filminig.

Happy to hear IMMORTALS is good. I missed it when it opened but think it may still be playing at the rep cinemas. Would like to see it on the big screen. Is Henry Cavill any good?

And since you guys talked Misfits last week, another British show I’ve just finished which is worth checking out is The Fades: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1772379/

I think Andrew in particular will appreciate Mac. He does all of the episode recaps. This one is actually quite good as it outlines the basics of the show. Runs for first 30 seconds.

And it looks like the entire first season is on youtube in 11 minute incriments:

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLC6DCAABFD28D28BF&feature=plcp

Nosgoth1979
Guest

Great podcast, you guys are seriously entertaining. I suppose I could be getting hypercritical but I’ve been burned so many times in recent memory by disappointing films, I’ve nearly stopped going to the theaters altogether. Unless something comes out that I really can’t wait for I’ll wait for its home release and put it in my Blockbuster Movie Pass queue. I was tempted by Immortals, and now that I heard you talking about it, I kind of wish I had gone. But it won’t take long for it to make it to Blockbuster since they get most of the new releases a month before Netflix and Redbox. Nothing against those two services, even though I’m an employee of DISH, I’ve used both before, it’s just that now that I have the Blockbuster Movie Pass I like it a lot better.

Rick Vance
Guest

Andrew I have problems with your generalizations about the reasons people wouldn’t have seen the original Girl With a Dragon Tattoo. Personally the only two words to get me interested in the material were David Fincher up until that point I had no interest in the story or seeing the film.

Also about setting the film in English in a country that doesn’t speak it, would you be complaining if they did decide to have everyone do accents and they were not able to pull them off? The throwing in of incidental words is just shorthand to tie it to the place without forcing actors to care more about maintaining accents than what they are delivering.

Also totally agree on the quality of Apocalypto but the best part about it being in a dead language is that the subtitles force you to watch the brutality because you may miss what someone is saying so the language adds to atmosphere of the film.

Matt did you hear what project Tarsem wants to do? Samurai Fucking Jack, after seeing Immortals imagine THAT movie, oh my god. Also did you see it in 3D because that really adds to the action the depth of field especially in the opening and in that first ‘god’ scene were amazing.

antho42
Guest

I will give Die Hard another chance — perhaps on Christmas. Just rewatch Leon: The Proffessional. It is fucking awesome. It is pure cinema. It has not age at all. I want to see a film with The Cge and The Oldman.

Chris S.
Guest

Andrew, You say people want this remake or are going to see it are stupid and lazy. Well maybe some of that is true, but on the other side the “critics” are just as bad. Because film critics are too easy on foreign films, and for the most part can’t really gage a performance fairly if they don’t understand the language. I grew up partially in Italy and the US. And I can’t tell how many times I get in augments with my american friends over italian films.

Rick Vance
Guest

Having seen the film it makes way more sense why the film was not relocated to anywhere but where it takes place. That setting is required for all the elements of the story to gel and make sense.

The railroad, the Nazis, the isolation of the island. I think the setting is important enough to the story that I can handle the fact that everyone has a variety of accents. This film is also the perfect fusion of the early Fincher and the modern Fincher into a new unsettling very methodical new whole that is AWESOME and for that alone this movie has every right to exist and yes the opening credits are amazing.

Gomez
Guest

Is Young Adult worth seeing. I loved Thank you for Smoking and Up In the Air, but didn’t care for Juno. What’s it closer too?

Goon
Guest

I really liked Young Adult and think its a big step up from Juno. Its kinda Noah Baumbach-y to me, character wise. So keep that in mind.

Gomez
Guest

Yeah, so my girlfriend and I saw it last night. Hate is a strong word but we both really didn’t like it. What was kind of shocking is that there was at least 15 walkouts.

Gomez
Guest

On a positive note, Patton Oswalt was really good in it.

Goon
Guest

I’d say the majority of movies I saw this year had at least one walk out.

The most walk outs was at Hugo.

Kurt
Guest

Over a quarter of my audience at TINKER TAILOR SOLDIER SPY walked out. But I saw it at the land-of-the-mouthbreather cinema, the Etobicoke Cineplex, so no surprise there.

Jandy
Guest

Y’all have weird audiences. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone walk out here, of anything. Unless I just don’t notice, but you’d think I would.

Gomez
Guest

A lot of my walk outs were younger girls. Im guessing they thought Young Adult was going to be a chick flick.

Jay C.
Guest

What is the definition of mouth breather?

Brittany
Guest

After listen to Kurt for many years, I’m guessing anyone who does not live in Toronto is a mouth breather. Sorry Jay.

Kurt
Guest

Heh. I don’t live in Toronto, technically, I live in Mississauga, which is a bedroom community a hairs breadth outside of Toronto, but also looked down upon by Toronto-ites, and residents of Oakville (the upper-crust old-money suburbs on the other side)

Mouthbreather. noun.

1. A moron from a low social caste. Picture someone with a sunken forehead, low hairline, and prominent chin.

2. Someone stupid who is unaware that their mouth is gaping open, often taking in gallons of air and spewing their own dry, bacteria rotten maw into your clean air in your vicinity.

3. Somebody who goes to Cineplex/FamousPlayers cinemas, buys the largest tub of popcorn, puts oily sludge on it only to arrive late to the showing, then proceeds to noisily find a seat while walking in front of people, before realizing within 20 minutes that Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy is not Johnny English Reborn.

Kurt Halfyard
Admin

rest assured, Brittany, Toronto has its fair share of mouthbreathers and rude cinema patrons (occasionally they drift into the film festivals or the AMC at Yonge & Dundas or the Carleton/Cumberland arthouses, but can usually be found in their natural habitat, the Scotiabank Cineplex at Richmond & John (not-so-affectionately known as the Scotiamount) or the Cineplex at Yonge & Eglington. although the bulk of them seem to live in the burgh of Etobicoke on the west side of the city…the buffer zone between Toronto and Mississauga.

Goon
Guest

From what I understand, anyone who isn’t paying proper attention for the first 20 minutes of TTSS is going to be a prime candidate for a walk out.

Jay C.
Guest

I’m assuming your definition (particularly the first point) is a joke. The whole thing reads like something Reed Farrington would say (or Adolf Hitler). Either way, I’ll engage in this for the sake of some good comment debate!

I know there’s an element of internet snark to all of this, but here are my thoughts (which will also contain internet snark!):

This term pops up quite often on the cinecast. I have a real problem with ‘mouth breather’ in this context. In regards to your definition, I will stand behind point two. It can be really annoying when somebody is breathing HARD through their mouth beside you during a movie. Outside of that, the use of this term seems to be rooted in some pretty nasty and presumptuous intellectual classism. Just because somebody leaves during a movie you like doesn’t mean they’re borderline retarded. Are we really using these movies as a gauge of intelligence? It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to follow the majority of movies, especially for those who watch a lot of them and have become familiar with the general language of cinema. I have no problem attacking somebody’ taste, but I think using somebody’s movie watching habits as ammo against their intelligence is cheap and blatantly elitist.

Yes, popcorn eating can be obnoxious, but I would never use it as evidence of my superiority over those who decide to do it. Kurt, how about the time you wolfed down a giant take out container of food during Hard Core Logo II at TIFF? Is it different because you didn’t buy it from the concession stand? It certainly didn’t smell as good as popcorn from where I was sitting!

I HATE bad manners at the movies when it directly affects my viewing enjoyment. I could care less if somebody doesn’t ‘get’ a film or if they don’t like the same type of movies I do.

Either way, I still love you Kurt.

RANT OVER (for now).

Jay C.
Guest

I went out of my way to catch TTSS when I was in Toronto for a meeting. I made the mistake of seeing it on little sleep (after having to get up early to beat rush hour traffic) and ended up nodding off intermittently throughout. This was disastrous and essentially resulted in me being lost and completely unable to describe the plot of the film afterwards. I wrote it off as not having seen it (although I remember how it ends).

Goon
Guest

I got the old version of TTSS on DVD and am still debating if I should watch that first or wait till after the movie. Advice?

Jay C.
Guest

I’d say if a quarter of an audience walked out of a film like TTSS, there’s a good chance that it’s because it was too slow. I think it’s fair to say that it’s a film that’s not for everybody, and I definitely don’t think that the only reason someone could dislike it is just not getting it. You and Matt didn’t like Tree of Life but I wouldn’t immediately jump to the conclusion that it’s because you’re both stupid.

Gomez
Guest

Yeah, let’s not get Intellectual capacity mixed up with understanding film. In my circles it’s quite the opposite. Some people who are creative type can understand film or art and what does it mean. Yet, I work as a TA at the university I attend and I can’t tell you how many times I hear the professors talk about the new Transformers movie or superhero movie. And they have little to no interest in seeing what andrew considers “Smart People” movies.

Jay C.
Guest

Yeah, I think even cinephiles are having issues following TTSS. I know I did (thanks to nodding off the whole time). I definitely want to revisit it ASAP though.

I think the important thing to remember is that some people just aren’t as interested in films in general, so they’re not game for having to do any sort of ‘work’ while watching films. It’s like me with video games…I appreciate them to a certain degree but will very easily lose interest if I have to restart over and over or get stuck for too long. I don’t think it’s a sign that I’m dumb (maybe) but rather 1. a lack of interest in video games in general, and 2. I haven’t played enough games to recognize basic video game language that might be clear to someone who’s played through a ton of them.

I think it’s less an intellect thing rather than an interest/experience thing. (That’s not to say there aren’t dumb people out there.)

Jay C.
Guest

P.S. The only reason I bring up stuff like this (and ‘off the rails’, etc.) is because the Cinecast is one of only a few podcasts I listen to regularly and enjoy, and part of that enjoyment is disagreement.

Matt Gamble
Guest

I’m pretty sure the reason why Jay walks out of Hong Kong films is that he has a unibrow and wears girl jeans.

MAHONEY
Guest

I’d like to point out that Matt has a girl-brow and wears Uni-jeans.

He also allows people to urinate in his sink, cannot pronounce Vincente, thinks everyone is Welsh, suffers from “Rancor Impulse-Buy Syndrome” and is OBSESSED with the volume of his doorbell.

Btw – I’ve recently become addicted to your podcast. Any chance of more becoming available on itunes?

Kurt
Guest

I should add that several of the people that walked out of the movie made rude comments (“We should have just watched Ghost Protocol Again”) or “Well, that sucked.” (letting the audience that is still staying hear these things is the hallmark of a true mouthbreather.

Kurt
Guest

On TTSS, I don’t think I could easily explain all the ins and outs and whathaveyous of the plotting, but I felt the film was about the atmosphere, and watching Gary Oldman do his thing…those were the pleasures of the story, not the whodunit, which to be honest, I didn’t care much about.

Gomez
Guest

I did see some two people walk out of Transformers 3. I’ve debating ever since whether they were too stupid or too smart. I guess we’ll never know.

Kurt
Guest

In short. It’s not about the ability to follow (who rigourously/completely followed PRIMER the first time that saw it? Few if none, that didn’t stop it from being a damn good movie experience.) I think people over-value plot/story some times, movies are often a lot more than that, but many people will shut down if the story gets ahead of them, or doesn’t hand-hold, instead of exercising a little patience and saying, “I don’t exactly know what is going on, but I’ll wait to see if I catch up, and enjoy everything else the film has on offer. Namely some fantastic cinematography, and a killer performance from Gary Oldman and his very large, very male ensemble.

Jay C.
Guest

So really, it just comes down to taste and an overall level of interest/disinterest in film. You can’t expect everybody to be as passionate about the cinema as you / we / I am, nor have the same interest in deeper, more complex forms of filmmaking. (Unless they pose as a movie pundit and obnoxiously push their severely uninformed opinions based on their HORRID taste in movies. Then they’re fair fucking game. You know who I’m talking about.)

Having said all of that, talking on the way out of the theatre while the movie is still on is a disruption and for that, they should be punished severely.

Goon
Guest

I walked out of Tinker Tailor. I knew well in advance how important it was to follow closely, and I did for a good while, until I just came to the inclusion that I just didn’t care about what was happening. It felt blatantly compressed from a much longer more detailed story, and everyone was way too low-key for me to take an interest in. And the story in general wasn’t doing it for me, worth the attention I had to pay to it in order to follow along. It looks as nice as LTROI, maybe even more so, but I think this thing is being given a huge benefit of the doubt for being so somber and confusing by nature of its casting, the director… one of those movies where its very easy for some to think the flaws were features. For another movie with more bombast or blatant interest in entertainment, these things would rightly get pointed out as storytelling flaws.

Goon
Guest

*conclusion
… oh, and the score of the film does it no favors. It felt like muzak to my ears.

Kurt
Guest

Again, I saw, it is the tone and vibe and not the story that makes TTSS a worthwhile bit of Cinema. It’s in my top 10 of the year even…

Jericho Slim
Guest

I re-watched Shame in the theater, and I can now totally see what Andrew was talking about when he was talking about the “artful” framing. I could see it being annoying.

That being said, I really liked it a whole lot more this time than the first time. I think that’s because I knew what to expect, and I could just sit back and enjoy it without wondering where the plot was going – which is nowhere.

The only thing that kept it from being a ’10’ in my book was Sissy’s (Carey Mulligan) “crisis” at the end of the movie. It felt out of place and somewhat of a stretch by the screenwriters to have some kind of dramatic climax.

I’m looking forward to watching Hunger on blu-ray, which just arrived from Netflix.

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